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Bistroganov (with question)

Recipe Quest » Tried and True Archives » Archive through March 7, 2005 » Archive February though December 2004 » Archive through April 5, 2004 » Bistroganov (with question) « Previous Next »

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johnc
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Username: johnc

Post Number: 3207
Registered: 12-2001

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Posted on Monday, April 5, 2004 - 12:53 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

We had some ground beef and mushrooms (plus some red and green bell peppers) left over from The Big SpaghettiDeluxo Feed, Saturday night. Sunday evening, I was trying to think of a slightly different way to use up the "fresh leftovers".

For some reason, I thought of (a minor league version of) "Jacqui T's World Class Beef Stroganov" and at about the same time I saw a box of Bisquick in the pantry.

I made the "Official J.T. Stroganov Sauce" (then sliced and prepared the onion (one whole) and mushrooms (one small container) according to J's recipe. I sauteed some diced bell peppers, then browned the (custom seasoned) ground beef on top of them. I added back the mushrooms and onions as per the original recipe. Then I put all of this to the side to cool off.

After a while, I made a Bisquick batter and grabbed a 9x9 baking dish (while the oven was heating up to 400 deg.)

I put the meat and onion/veggie/mushroom mixture in the bottom of the baking dish, sprinkled some CheddarJack and Four Cheese Italian over it, then poured on the batter. It baked for about 25 min. before it looked like it was done. I served it with some steamed asparagus finised with butter and Marsala.

It was pretty good--and I'd do it again--but I'm wondering about how it might be possible to add some sour cream (like in real Beef Stroganov) to this thing without ruining it completely.

I've noticed that J's recipe for Southwestern Chicken Casserole comes out REALLY good and it has both sour cream and yogurt in it that bakes in with the rest of the stuff for about the same amount of time at the same temperature. If you let the sour cream come to a boil in the Stroganov recipe, the sauce breaks and clots.

Do you suppose that a person would be okay with just swirling some sour cream into the mix before putting it into the baking dish and into the oven? Of course, I'd leave out the cheese if I did this, but somehow--as good as it was--it just lacked something and I think it was the tang of the sour cream.

~John C.
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moirainesedai
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Username: moirainesedai

Post Number: 1035
Registered: 2-2002

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Posted on Monday, April 5, 2004 - 1:05 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Why would u leave out the cheese if u added sourcream by swirling it in which sounds just fine (to me anyway)...?
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johnc
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Username: johnc

Post Number: 3208
Registered: 12-2001

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Posted on Monday, April 5, 2004 - 1:11 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I'd leave out the cheese as a protest to the principles of the Atkins Diet, Moira. =)

No, really, I'd leave it out simply to make it more like a Stroganov Bake instead of a RusskieCheesburger Bake. (You don't include cheese in Beef Stroganov. Really. You don't.)

Besides that, the sour cream adds it's own layer of flavor to the dish that the cheese could overwhelm. And you should know how important it is not to overwhelm any flavors involved in a Bisquick Bake. =)

~John C.
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renée
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Username: renée

Post Number: 3116
Registered: 6-2002

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Posted on Monday, April 5, 2004 - 1:54 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I agree with you, John C. - no cheese.
Renée
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jacqui
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Username: jacqui

Post Number: 7788
Registered: 12-2001

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Posted on Monday, April 5, 2004 - 1:58 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Yeah, well you don't put ground beef in stroganov either

Guess you should call it Impossible Stroganoff Pie (note Americanized spelling). Definately lose the cheese. Here's a thought. Creme fraiche. It doesn't break and has a nice little tang. Very easy to make - 1 cup heavy cream and 2 T buttermilk, leave at room temp 24-48 hours until thick, stir and chill. Ready to go.

I make it frequently as I like cooking with it. Also, a yummy topping for Mexican food - mash an avocado until smooth with a few tablespoons of lime juice & pinch of salt; fold into a cup of creme fraiche and chill.
J
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johnc
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Username: johnc

Post Number: 3210
Registered: 12-2001

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Posted on Monday, April 5, 2004 - 2:10 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

"Impossible [Stroganoff/Cheeseburger] Pie" . . .
Fess up, Jacqui: You have a Box o' Bisquick lurking in your pantry.

I'm still wondering why--since sour cream (mixed with yogurt and Cream of Chicken soup) holds up so well in YOUR Southwestern Chicken Casserole-- it wouldn't hold up in this. I've never seen Creme Fraiche in the Dairy cooler at the sto' . . . Not even Braums.... =)

~John C.
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monica
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Username: monica

Post Number: 2175
Registered: 5-2003

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Posted on Monday, April 5, 2004 - 2:32 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Hi John, basically it is a mince mixture and if you stirred in the sour cream without cooking I do not think it will split, in fact I am sure it would not as it is a different method of cooking.
The mince bakes in with the batter so the sour cream won't split.
I cook curries with sour cream and it does not split when it is reheated the next day.So I think you would be O.K with it.
You are right about leaving out the cheese.
Monica
A recipe is only a theme,which an intelligent cook can play each time with a variation.
... Madame Benoit...

It's not ingredients that make food delicious it's your special touch that creates those flavours...Monica...

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jacqui
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Username: jacqui

Post Number: 7789
Registered: 12-2001

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Posted on Monday, April 5, 2004 - 2:34 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I do have a box of Bisquick - made pancakes yesterday morning. Occasionally make biscuits and there was a fried chicken recipe using it too. Have never made one of those impossible pie things.

The soup (cream of chicky) is so full of stabilizers and thickening agents that probably take care of the sour cream and yogurt won't break anyway.

Creme fraiche in Podunk Ok? Even I have to drive into Dallas (Central Market) but making it is so simple.
J
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dchem
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Username: dchem

Post Number: 1796
Registered: 3-2002

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Posted on Monday, April 5, 2004 - 4:33 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Scuze my ignorance but is Mexican table cream anything like creme fraiche? I'm serious, I thought the two were about the same. The stuff I'm talking about (hell all I can think to call it is table cream) is thick, almost like clotted cream and I'm sure they call it crema de something....
dchem®
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renée
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Username: renée

Post Number: 3117
Registered: 6-2002

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Posted on Monday, April 5, 2004 - 5:26 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Just been into a Mexican web-site and yes, the Mexican Table Cream can be used instead of Creme Fraiche. It also contains guar gum, carageenan and a little salt.
Renée
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jacqui
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Username: jacqui

Post Number: 7790
Registered: 12-2001

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Posted on Monday, April 5, 2004 - 5:26 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

You are right dchem, Crema, but it lacks the bite and at $4 a jar I make the creme fraiche for about $1.50.
J
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johnc
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Username: johnc

Post Number: 3211
Registered: 12-2001

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Posted on Monday, April 5, 2004 - 5:36 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Yes, Jacqui, but does yours have carageenan and guar gum? I think not.

BTW: I know where Bug Tussle, Maud and Bowlegs are, but I'm afraid the location of Podunk eludes me . . . That's OK I guess: They probably wouldn't have Creme Fraiche OR Crema anyways.

~John C.
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monica
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Username: monica

Post Number: 2176
Registered: 5-2003

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Posted on Monday, April 5, 2004 - 6:43 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

John maybe this will help you.
Creme Fraiche

The French version of fresh, heavy cream, it's thicker and more tart. Delicious spooned over fresh fruit or other desserts such as warm cobblers or puddings. It is the ideal addition for sauces or soups because it can be boiled without curdling.

1 cup heavy cream
2 tablespoons buttermilk
Place the cream and buttermilk in a glass container. Let stand, uncovered at room temperature for 24 hours, or until very thick. Stir well before covering and refrigerate up to 10 days.
Makes 1 cup.

Cook's Note: Ultrapasteurized (sterilized) cream takes considerably longer to thicken than fresh cream.



Monica
A recipe is only a theme,which an intelligent cook can play each time with a variation.
... Madame Benoit...

It's not ingredients that make food delicious it's your special touch that creates those flavours...Monica...

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jacqui
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Username: jacqui

Post Number: 7795
Registered: 12-2001

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Posted on Monday, April 5, 2004 - 7:35 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is there an echo in here?:-)
J

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